Everyone is Equal…

Confusion sets in only if you don’t realize that some BEE more Equal than others

You’re a delusional liberal and there is no way for our worldviews to be reconciled.

For my readers, the final word, as my time to spend responding, casting pearls before swine, is limited:

1. The prescence of white liberal “useful idiots” singing the song proves nothing. There has always been a small elite of intellectuals who work against the interests of their people, hoping to carve out a niche for themselves post-revolution. This is merely one piece of evidence, at a minimum establishing the violent, revolutionary nature of Mandela, something inline with a Communist viewpoint.

2. “The raised clenched fist was popularized by the Communist Party, and in some locations it maintains that association. In the United States, the raised fist was associated with the Black Power movement.”

3. You admit that the BEE IS wealth redistribution, but you support it because you believe in liberal Marxist delusions about the equality of man, enforced at the point of a gun of course. I do not, so therefore I oppose it, and feel no need to propose an alternative to free enterprise. But at least we agree on the facts, which is progress.

4. The Heritage Foundation is a conservative think tank, but I do not think they have a record of fabricating quotes. Absent a contradicting reference, a reasonable person would assume the report true. You ignore the much weightier evidence of the AP archives.

5. The Mandela/Castro picture is part of the body of proof and adds to the case that Mandela is a Communist. By itself it means little, but with Mandela’s other documented statements and associations, there is proof beyond a reasonable doubt that Mandela is indeed a Communist.

6. A South African woman has a 1 in 3 chance of being raped by her 18th birthday. That qualifies the country as a hellhole, and it is certainly multicultural: thus a multicultural hellhole.

An estimated one in three South African girls is raped by her 18th birthday.

There have been sporadic reports of rape victims being raped again in police stations. Fewer than 20 percent of rapes in 1998 were prosecuted, and just nine percent of reported rapes in South Africa ultimately result in a conviction.

That’s got to be hard to process through your ideological filter, but facts are facts. This is UC-Berkeley reporting, not a conservative group in any sense.

7. The very definition of ethnic cleansing is seizing people’s land on an ethnic basis. You can sugar-coat it by calling it “redistribution” but it is what it is. They’re taking it from one owner and giving it to another on the basis of ethnicity. That’s ethnic cleansing. I’m not sure where you’re getting the genocide idea from- SA’s still a ways off from Zimbabwe, though that’s coming I’m sure. They’ll take your land, then they’ll start killing you once they realize their dreams of a free ride are not going to happen due to economic realities and corrupt African leadership.

8. 50,000 people have purchased rape insurance according to the Berkeley article. That is not only a market, but a huge one. There is an insurance market where there is risk to be mitigated, and in SA the risk of rape is very real for every woman. No similar situation exists in any other nation that I’m aware of, where a major insurer is issuing these kinds of policies. To compare the plight of South African rape victims to delusions of alien abduction is cruel and reveals the depths to which the liberal mindset will sink to redeem their sick ideology.

I understand this is a very unpleasant set of facts to discuss, and I find it somewhat distasteful- I know that man is fallen, but sometimes I prefer to not expose myself to the details of man’s depravity, especially on that most depraved of continents, Africa. However, I think it is inspirational to consider the history of the Boers, a Christian people who have survived and until recently, prospered, amidst so much spiritual darkness. Their experience of pioneering a virgin land and fighting merciless enemies parallels the America experience.

I just hope the parallel stops at some point before we find ourselves in a similar position as the Boers today. And I’m serious- we should offer Afrikaner amnesty to extend Christian charity to this proud people now being oppressed under a corrupt Communist government.

Once again regarding the ‘communist fist’, your misinterpretation of this gesture is baffling. You seem to have the time on your hands- you do the research and tell me I’m wrong!

The (sic) BEE is a wealth distribution program- case closed! No arguments there, however the justification behind it is a logical one, and should you feel the need to argue the logic of BEE as a means to an end, then please offer a viable alternative rather than poking holes in a solution.

“Here is a quote from a similar rally…” and you link to a website/article aimed at spreading conservative ideas… not exactly impartial representation of facts if you ask me.

“At least have the decency to not abuse the meaning of language to enable an honest debate.”- Please explain how you come to the conclusion that the redistribution of land and ethnic cleansing are linked?…and please don’t abuse the language.

Please provide information regarding where and when the photo of Mandela and Castro was taken. (By this logic anyone with Castro is a communist http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/1999/pope/bio/papal/link.pope.castro.jpg)

“Multicultural hellhole”- yip you’re a xenophobe- let’s be fair.
“There’s a market for ‘rape insurance’”, - there’s a market for insurance against everything all over the world… I can imagine you’re busy looking over your alien abduction protection policy as we speak. But hey- I’m the delusional one.

Here’s an important question Tom which I need you to answer. Have you been to South Africa, do you have any idea what you are talking about. The reason I ask is because I need to understand whether your opinions are from personal experience or are they founded in what the media is telling you.

The BEE is clearly a wealth redistribution program, which you acknowledge as such, yet refuse to see the injustice of forcing family businesses to turn over ownership to quota-entitled beneficiaries.

You won’t accept any source I could offer because it conflicts with your religous faith in liberalism and psychological need to make excuses for why reality is in conflict with your ideology. You produce no proof, you reference no sources, but just advance ad ignoratum objections and insistence that you are right because you say so. That is the very essence of how liberals argue: no facts, just generalizing and moralizing.

But, just for sport, let’s review a little more of the Mandela history:

In this video, you see Mandela sing about killing whites-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fcOXqFQw2hc

Here is a quote from a similar rally where he praised the Communist cause:

“At the very moment communism was collapsing in Eastern Europe, Mandela praised the South African Communist Party in his first speech following his release from prison. Mandela said in Cape Town on February 11: “We are heartened by the fact that the alliance between ourselves and the Party remains asstrong as it always was.”

Here is a page from the Associated Press documenting that they have video footage of several events of Mandela and his wife with Communists, with a description:

13 December 1990 JOHANNESBURG
(Oliver Tambo comes home but fails to shift ANC on sanctions)
ANC President, Oliver Tambo, embracing Communist Party leader, Joe Slovo
Tambo greeting other colleagues
CU ANC Information Secretary, Thabo Mbeki
Tambo receives scarf in ANC colours from young boy
CU Nelson Mandela standing beside Tambo
Mandela and Tambo approach balcony
police at airport PAN to Tambo waving to crowd from balcony
MS Tambo with hands raised:

2 February 1991 JOHANNESBURG
GV Nelson Mandela at presser, flanked by ANC General Secretary, Alfred Nzo and Communist Party ldr, Joe Slovo:

5 July 1991 DURBAN
(ANC leadership elections of Mandela, Sisulu, Ramaphosa and Nkobi)
Outgoing ANC Secretary-General, Alfred Nzo,voting
Communist Party leader, Joe Slovo
Outgoing President, Oliver Tambo, voting
Mandela voting
delegates arriving
15 December 1991 TRANSKEI
(Winnie Mandela, speaking at 30th anniversary of ANC military wing, Umkhonto We Sizwe, warns of armed revolution if democracy fails)
Cars arriving at anniversary rally
Winnie Mandela and Chris Hani, leader of the ANC military wing Umkhonto We Sizwe, on stage in guerrilla uniform
ANC and Communist Party flags
brass bands
Winnie Mandela, sot, marking military anniversary, leading chanting

And finally, a photo of Mandela with his buddy Castro:

That’s the face of two comrades, not uneasy political allies.

Regarding the BEE laws:

Quoting directly from regulations issued by the South African government:

The process of BEE must result in an increase in the ownership and control of the economy by black persons. This means that a significant proportion of black persons’ ownership of assets and enterprises must be a controlling interest, reflecting genuine participation in decision-making at board, executive management and operations levels, and the assumption of real risk.
In the scorecard, direct empowerment focuses on ownership of enterprises and assets through shares and other instruments that provide the holder thereof with voting rights and economic benefits, such as dividends or interest payments.
Control means:
• The right or the ability to direct or otherwise control the majority of the votes attaching to the shareholder’s issued shares,
• The right or ability to appoint or remove directors holding a majority of voting rights at meetings of the board of directors of that shareholder,
• The right to control the management of that shareholder.

This is, plain and simply, mandatory government redistribution of wealth on a racial basis. You may make excuses for it or justify it, but it does not change what it is. At least have the decency to not abuse the meaning of language to enable an honest debate.

And most blatantly, the SA government now reveals a plan to continue down the path of land seizing and ethnic cleansing pursued by their Communist allies in Zimbabwe:

South Africa’s 50,000 white farmers are threatened with forced land expropriation after a government land summit called for a “fast-track” programme of redistribution.

You can drink the Kool-Aid all you want, but if protecting my daughters from the fate of living in a multicultural hellhole where there’s a market for “rape insurance” makes delusional liberals call me a “xenophobe”, I’ll gladly accept the label. Besides, that’s not really fair- I think the US ought to give full citizenship and free land to any Afrikaner family who wants to emigrate out of the SA mess before it’s too late.

Mandela showing some Cuban loving: Firstly please link to the correct wikiquote page, and secondly please understand the context of what is being said by our former President, and Nobel peace prize winner. His remarks are one of identifying with Fidel Castro’s cause, but in no way aligning the ANC with Communism. Bear in mind Mandela is also famous for ‘identifying’ with the PLO in Palestine however he doesn’t support the PLO’s cause, but I don’t see you including this as it doesn’t support your argument.

‘Communist’ picture: Please provide source of picture, as I suspect this too has been taken out of context. And the ’salute’ was/is used by the ANC in much the same way as the extended raised fist is synonymous with ‘black power’, rather than that of communism.

Wikipedia definition of BEE: Please note that the neutrality of that wikipedia entry has been disputed, and as such I can’t see how you can use it as a source of ‘hard facts’.

“While not technically required by law, it is all but impossible to operate without complying”: You then refer to a South African site describing BEE. I would stress any of your readers to actually read the full article to gain an understanding of the BEE process rather than your ’snippet’ which only serves to blur the facts.

“Reaction of Afrikaner business owners”: Are you really trying to use this article as a source of facts? Come on… communist friend?- rubbish!

“For my fellow Americans reading this, don’t write this off as a parochial South African problem. In South Africa, we see our immediate future if we allow our immigration policies to turn us into a Third World country.” - Your condition is called- Xenophobia.

How do you like them apples?

You are trying to create an image of this country that is completely twisted. Your comments suggest that anyone exercising his or her right to freedom of expression is cut down by an intolerant communist government. This is not the Soviet Union or even China. South Africa has one of the most liberal constitutions in the world today (in some respects the US Constitution looks intolerant and conservative compared to ours).

What we do have is a history of terrible injustices perpetrated against the non-white majority of our population by a racist government. While circumstances are hardly perfect in South Africa (crime being a big issue for us), the government and South Africans in general have taken a number of positive steps towards remedying the wrongs of the past. One of these steps is the Black Economic Empowerment imperative which has certainly been controversial and difficult for white South Africans. At the same time it is a necessary process which will hopefully come to an end sooner rather than later.

Your views are more representative of the views that got us into the mess we are in in the first place. You are looking in from the outside with a specific perspective and if this is all you see then you have missed the miracle that was achieved when power shifted in 1994 and the good work that has been done in the meantime. Granted our government is not perfect and come up with some real gems at times but South Africa has made some real progress in the last decade or so. At least give us the respect we deserve for doing the best we can in the face of such historic challenges.

Mandela makes Communist quotes and praises Communist leaders = Mandela is a Communist.

Being on a rugby team is more than just a mindset, but being a rugby fan is similarly a mindset.

The analogy you were looking for is that if a picture of you was taken at an All Blacks rugby match, while wearing an All Blacks jersey, and cheering an All Blacks goal, then it would mean you were an All Blacks fan.

That would be a correct logical deduction.